From Public Health to UX: Michelle's Journey of Empathy and Inclusivity in Research

Brandon: Thank you for speaking with me today! Can you tell me a little bit about your background and how you first got into UX research?

Michelle: Yes. So my background is in public health. I majored in Kinesiology in undergrad within the School of Public Health at the University of Maryland. The whole time, I wanted to be a physical therapist, but I wasn't very good at it. I thought, "This is kind of cool, but I don't know." 

Then, in my senior year, I discovered the only Black professor in the kinesiology department. She studied the effects of gentrification on physical activity and health behaviors, and I thought her work was so cool. That's when I realized I was really interested in people's behaviors.

Right after that, I got my Master's in Public Health from Emory with a concentration in behavioral and social sciences. I did a lot of work understanding behaviors, studying different theories, and conducting both qualitative and quantitative research. I also did a lot of community-based work, collaborating with various nonprofits in Atlanta to evaluate health programs. I also did policy work sometimes and a little product work. My first job out of grad school was at a consulting firm, where I did very traditional public health work. I was doing community-based program evaluations, and we were evaluating a sexual and reproductive health program. Everyone on our team who conducted focus groups either had a public health background or were pulled from the UX team that the consulting firm also had. 

It was interesting because, at the end of the day, we all had a qualitative background, whether it was from public health or UX. They were UX researchers and cognitive scientists, but we all had the same skill set. This drove me to explore other things I could do with my background and degree. So, after being a consultant for a year and a half, I moved to my first official UX research role. Now, I work at a pharmaceutical/health tech company.

Brandon: I'm curious to hear more about your background in public health. Have you felt like that has served you well in your UX career?

Michelle: I do. I really do. Currently, I work in the health space, sure. But even before that, I feel like my ability to look at both micro and macro levels has been valuable. In public health, we use the social ecological model, which looks at any behavior or health outcome from the individual level all the way to policy, including communit and social influences as well. I like being able to zoom in and out—understanding my interactions with people, what they are saying, and how that big picture affects the product or how we need to build the product.

A big thing in public health is empathy. In UX, people talk about empathy a lot too, but it's important not to overstep. Having humility to understand that I may not fully understand someone’s experiences is crucial. It’s important to gather all viewpoints to ensure everyone's experiences are part of building a product. With my community-based background, I hope to do more throughout my career. In UX, we call it co-design, and in public health, it’s community-based research. Whatever you call it, it’s about ensuring that users, especially marginalized communities, are partners in decision-making.

Brandon: Right, I agree.

Michelle: And I keep saying products, but it includes products, programs, policies, services, and experiences. It’s bigger than just an app; it could be a physical product or something else entirely.

Brandon: That's why it's called user experience. Keep it broad.

Michelle: Yeah.

Brandon: You mentioned that you were exposed to UX during consulting, but I know in consulting you're exposed to all types of fields. What specifically sparked your interest in UX?

Michelle: During consulting, I was also exposed to health policy work. People often think health policy is always big picture, but it’s not always. I was working with Medicaid and Medicare, which involved a lot of financial aspects. It was boring, and I wasn't able to talk to people. I feel like I need to be able to talk to people and connect with them. If appropriate, I like to be allowed into their space. Sometimes it's not only about people telling us things but showing us how they live, work, and behave. I think the personal connection is really important to me.

And honestly, keeping it real, I follow the path of least resistance. I keep that in mind for my whole career. I think my skill set in behavioral science, qualitative research, and public health has allowed me to be a program evaluator, a public health consultant, and now a UX researcher. Everyone thinks I'm making such big jumps, but I'm really doing the same things in different contexts.

I'm really interested in service design, so maybe I can help with that one day or even become a service designer. When I do that, it won't be the biggest leap. I don't have goals like becoming a manager, department head, or VP. I just want to be challenged enough but not overwhelmed. I don't want to pursue another master's in something like rocket science. It's about balancing the path of least resistance with being challenged and enjoying what I'm doing.

Brandon: Absolutely, yeah. I think that balance attracts a lot of people to this career field. Can you tell me a little more about how your identity as a Black researcher has shaped your career path and experiences?

Michelle: Yeah, I feel like I'm definitely a champion for health equity and related issues. But I also feel that because I'm Black, people often assume I'm the DEI expert. I'm just a Black girl from Maryland; I don't know every Black person in America or every identity and experience that exists.

It goes beyond being a champion for equity. It's about opening everyone up to the idea that we should all care about accessibility. It shouldn't be just one researcher or an equity team responsible for these things. Even though people may assume I have certain viewpoints, it shouldn't only be on minorities or marginalized communities to address these issues.

Brandon: I feel that a lot, especially when you are Black and involved in diversity work.

Michelle: Exactly. As a Black person from Maryland, I understand. I don't want to be the go-to person for all Black perspectives. For example, if we're doing a UX research project and don't have any Black women in our sample, I don't want people to come to me and ask for my opinion as a stand-in. I don't know.

Michelle: Let's talk to a large group of Black women to find diverse perspectives, because another Black woman and I could have completely different viewpoints. That's fine as long as we hear them all.

Brandon: That is so important. So, in your view, how does the UX research field support Black practitioners, and where does it fall short? I'm particularly interested in hearing if you can compare it to your experience in the public health space.

Michelle: Yeah, so it's interesting. In grad school, there were different concentrations like epidemiology, global health, environmental health, and behavioral and social sciences. In my concentration, behavioral and social sciences, there were a lot of Black people. Grad school felt like my place, but when I moved into consulting, I was like, "Wait, where is everybody?" And so I kind of feel like it’s all of corporate America because when I was a public health consultant, even working in UX, it's kind of all the same for me.

And I think in the public health world, people are a bit more cognizant of it. If we have a majority-whatever team, insert whatever identity, people are very quick to call that out because a big thing in the public health space is understanding how your identities affect the communities that you're partnering with. And so, I think moving away from a traditional public health space, it almost became less of a thing to call out, you know?

Brandon: Yeah.

Michelle: So it's been kind of weird. I don't know if I have a really good answer for that. I don't know if I feel like there's the most support there unless I go and seek it out. Umm... yeah, I'm not sure.

Brandon: Are there any changes that you'd like to see companies make to better attract, support, and retain Black talent?

Michelle: YES! When thinking about Black talent attraction, the first layer of that is knowledge. Does Black talent know your company exist? Are you making strides for that happen? When thinking of students, yes go to HBCUs, but also the non-HBCUs, are you interacting with Black student orgs? When you come to the university for a career fair, ask the school who they have marketed it to. Apply pressure! Show it’s important to you to ensure there’s a diverse set of students. Also, are we starting early? We don’t just have to have internships for college and graduate students! The consulting company I worked at actually had summer programs starting as early as middle school. Go to cities with large Black populations and share your programs and make them accessible, go to rural areas too! Oh and there are a ton of Black professional organizations too. Some companies also put a disclaimer for minority groups and women about how they are less likely to apply for jobs they don’t feel 100% about and urging them to apply, and I like when I see those because it’s true and to hear reassurance from the company side is cool and can be just the push someone needs. When it comes to support and retention, that’s harder for me to speak about because one it’s super complex and two, it’s just so different for people. For me personally, I need to feel safe emotionally and mentally. I feel like I have had a successful career for many reasons, but especially because I’ve had really great managers. Ensuring someone is thriving is a team-effort, but I think it is especially important for managers to ensure the work environment supports that. So interestingly enough, companies need to ensure they have managers that see and support me fully for who I am, and I am many things, including a Black woman! What’s also very important to me is if the company provides support for upskilling whether it is furthering your education, going to conferences, etc. I think for me at least, it’s important that a company provides resources for that. Wait, back to attracting talent! 

We need hiring managers and recruiters to expand their understanding of different fields. For example, I run a page called Public Health in Tech (LinkedIn, Instagram, TikTok), where I show people with public health backgrounds how their skills translate to jobs they may not have considered. I talk about roles like behavioral scientists, qualitative researchers, and program evaluators and suggest looking into UX research. For those in health communication or health promotion, I suggest exploring content design and UX writing. They may not have heard of these job titles, but they're doing very similar things.

I love working on the job seeker side, showing people different roles that are open to them. But I also want to work on the company side, encouraging them to broaden their degree requirements or maybe not specify a degree type at all. If applicants have the necessary skills, that should be enough.

I feel very passionate about this because job postings can be intimidating. People often say to apply if you meet 30%, 50%, or 80% of the qualifications. I'm not doing calculations when I apply—I either feel good about it or I don't. People need to understand there's a lot of overlap in skills across different roles.

Brandon: Completely agree. So, going back to your career, do you want to speak more about what type of health research you do?

Michelle: Yes. OK, let's see. So, I work for a large global pharmaceutical company. We create digital health products and services for clinical trials. Think of the patients, the hospitals, clinics, and the pharmaceutical company—all working together to create a seamless experience from web to mobile apps to medical devices.

Brandon: Alright, getting back to the UXR field as a whole, what advice would you have for young Black professionals interested in getting into UX research? Any recommendations regarding education and gaining experience?

Michelle: Yeah. I would say if you're a student, take advantage of being a student. Not just with internships, but if there are companies or businesses near you and you want to provide a service, reach out to them. If I messaged them right now, they'd be like, "Who is this grown woman?"

Michelle: You know, sometimes they're just not too open, but if you say, "Hey, I'm a student, you know, from X university," I did that in grad school, and I was very successful in doing that. So use your student status to your benefit. I think it can be so, so helpful.

Also, what else? Don't be afraid to try doing research in places that aren't stamped as UX research. Like your sociology department, your psychology department, public health, behavioral sciences—there's a lot of human-centered research going on there. Anthropology, political science—it depends on what's happening. When I was at the School of Public Health, I did a housing & public health policy evaluation project at the School of Political Science. No, it wasn't specifically at the School of Public Health, but it's one of my favorite experiences to speak to when I'm in interviews because I went to those who were on housing vouchers. I would go to their houses and speak with them. It was a really great fieldwork experience.

I would also say, reach out to people who are UX researchers. But I'm gonna be a hypocrite because I probably have like 150 unread LinkedIn messages. But also, with that being said, don't be afraid. Coffee chats are good. Face-to-Face time is good. But if you also just want to be like, "Oh, can I send you a few questions?" and you can just respond anytime, just providing options for people to get back to you. It's so much easier for me to just answer a couple of questions through text or email or whatever.

Definitely try to go to conferences, summits, things like that. And then I think LinkedIn is great. LinkedIn is great to find different people, learn just about what's happening in the world, and maybe find a niche that would be really cool. You don't have to become a LinkedIn influencer, I promise. You can just use it and go home. I would also say Facebook groups—there are great UX Facebook groups where you can ask questions. Oh, there's also organizations that allow you to volunteer like UX Rescue, Hack for LA, and Democracy Lab. So you can do volunteer UX research, which has pros and cons. But I just want to provide options. And then I guess the last thing would be, if you're interested in UX research, look into more jobs that don't only say UX research. Maybe you'll find something that says human-centered researcher. I promise you, you and the UX researcher on the team are going to be utilizing identical skills. Human-centered research, behavioral design, service design, maybe even human factors, engineering or research. So just expand your scope. Sometimes companies—your job title is simply gonna depend on, say, your manager who has a certain title and you're just gonna adopt it, but you're all doing UX research. Sometimes companies just like to have a new funky title and that's OK. You're doing UX research, so there's a lot out there. I know I just listed off a bunch of things.

One more thing: if somebody is graduating college or grad school and wants to become a UX researcher, it's OK if your first job is not in UX research. It doesn't mean all hope is lost. It doesn't mean you're doomed. Your career can be as long as you want it to be. It could be your second job, it could be your part-time job, it could be your third job. Just keep going at it, and the skills you learn in whatever job you first get can be applied to the next.

Brandon: Absolutely, many of my colleagues came from different fields before going into UXR.

I came from policy research into UX research. People come from all different directions.

When I started this blog, I realized my experience is unique. Everyone's experience is unique.

So, for our last question, is there anything else you'd like to share about your experiences or perspective on making UX research more inclusive?

Michelle: This is to all the companies out there: I think we need more UX internships. I do. I think we need more UX internships, fellowships, apprenticeships, whatever. And not just research, not just design. Don't forget the UX writers.

I saw a job posting recently and it said, "Bachelor's degree from a competitive university." My friend likes to call me a “Karen for social good” because I am now going to email the co-founder of that company. What do you mean by "competitive university"? If we're thinking “competitive” universities, those are usually very expensive. Who are we leaving out when you're recruiting? It's not even just about taking that out of the job description; we need to deep dive into the culture of a team that only looks for competitive universities.

So, a lot of it is on companies, but also on us as UX researchers. I'll call myself out—I think I need to do more for those who reach out to me. I'm thinking about what I can do with Public Health in Tech to show people more about UX research, how to get into it, and tips and tricks on building portfolios. 

I guess it could be small things like maybe I could do a weekly portfolio review for people because, you know, when you're first trying to get a job, you probably have to make a portfolio. So, even myself and other UX researchers—how can we help others?

Brandon: I love what you said about the competitive universities. There's a lot to unpack there.

Michelle: Yea, like, what do you mean by that exactly?

Brandon: Exactly! This is why we need more Karens for good! Thank you so much for speaking with us today Michelle!